One Perfect Match? [Archive] - Youth Quake Forums

JoeC

05-09-2006, 09:06 AM

Following the same thought line as everyone else, that of foreknowledge:

Foreknowledge means that God knows what happens to us before we even do. Before we were even born. But it doesn't follow that by his foreknowledge he selected a certain certain mate for us. There's still free will to be considered.

I should think that the case could be made that that the Christian has the free will to choose a mate and have multiple outcomes that would still be in the will of the Lord. Where do we get this notion that we're locked into one certain mate and have to go find her?

The case isn't there folks. The only thing I see is criteria given for the selection of a mate. I still have yet to see the scripture or quote that indicates where a guy looking at two sisters filled with the Holy Ghost and beautiful in the character and holiness of Christ has only one correct choice. "Better get the right one or else that other sister, godly she may be, will be water in your blood, boy!" That's not what the scripture says.

NeedGod

05-09-2006, 09:11 AM

JoeC

05-09-2006, 09:15 AM

Well, technically there is only one outcome - and God knows what it is. But like I said in the last post, there's no evidence that the outcome is something that we're locked into as having to make the one right choice among thousands of qualified candidates.

Jezz

05-09-2006, 09:44 AM

oh, in that case, in the long run, there is the correct choice then huh? :confused: only we have to get it right. ok, i think i get it, only i am not too sure about it. its been jumbled up in my brain

the correct choice would be the one that is in the perfect will of God, any other choice would be his permissive will, even if that choice is a true Christian and believer and everything you want and expect in a wife.

NeedGod

05-09-2006, 09:47 AM

ah! i think i get it now...

AndrewMichael

05-09-2006, 11:07 AM

Well, Brother Branham did say if you didn't get the right "one" here you get the right "one" on the other side. I think that is evidence enough for me that we are supposed to have a certain mate, and we are lead to this mate beyond the world's way of finding one ~ feelings, dating, reasoning ~ and though direct leadership in the Holy Ghost, having complete faith that He knows best.

JoeC

05-09-2006, 01:26 PM

Andrew, your arguement based on the use of the word "one" is semantic at best and I don't find it very strong. No offense.

As far as the perfect will arguement, does everyone here really believe there is only one perfect will? It's something I've given thought to and still don't have an answer. The whole "perfect will, permissive will" is a tricky lens to look through and can get obfuscated very quickly. I question the whole neat and pretty concept.

The very phrase "perfect will" implies that there is an ideal way of doing things. Is it then God's perfect will for you to be doing what you're doing right now? Brother Branham said you can never pray too much. Maybe you should be doing that right now instead. Maybe that would be God's perfect will. Or maybe there are cases where God is neutral between the choices we make and leaves it up to us. "My son, both these choices please me. Which one brings you joy?"

One and only one perfect will? I don't think so. The scripture tells us that the footsteps of the Lord are ordered by the righteous and even gives us the more radical concept that everything works out according to the Lord's will in the end. I'm not suggesting that one should just "do anything", trusting that it will work out to God's will - I'm only saying that it's not as simple as some make it out to be.

This rigid concept of God's will is even further blown out of the water when we read what the Bible has to say. Accounts like God ordering a prophet to marry a prostitute (not former prostitute, mind you) bring our whole understanding of God's will into question. Further accounts of incest in the family tree of Israel and a captain of the hosts of Israel marrying a gentile magnify the problem of putting God's will in a box. Meanwhile, we see no clear doctrine proclaiming that God has a set and single perfect will, a category called His permissive will, and then the things that are out of His will. The concept bears some semblance to what we see in the Bible, but something has been lost through the interpretation that man has crafted. Learn to question the sacred cows of Christendom and prove them by the Bible. If someone hadn't been willing to do that, we wouldn't be where we are today.

AndrewMichael

05-09-2006, 01:40 PM

Don't worry, it takes a lot to offend me, and we shouldn't agree on everything.

I still don't understand what you are saying really. I believe we are lead by faith. That is usually too hard for people. They need something they can feel, touch, handle, reason, etc., something more natural than faith. Faith goes beyond reason. We all know God has a perfect will and a permissive will, it is in the Bible. And we can be out of His will. Can we understand God fully? No. We are humans, thus impossible. But we can KNOW Him by faith. We know because we have a relationship with Him. Does a wife really understand everything about her husband? No, but they know each other, as we should be with God. Trusting Him even when we don't understand.

Maybe I'm just too black and white but I don't see how to make any sort of platform on how we have multiple options given by God for a mate. That just doesn't make sense to me. God has one way. He doesn't change. Please explain how you believe this idea, or why you would even want to? I know I don't want to have anything to do with picking my mate. I have made LOTS of mistakes in that area and realized that I just want Him to make it, and so I give it to Him by faith, believing He knows who is the one for me. Let me know...

JMG

05-09-2006, 01:49 PM

jtucker

05-09-2006, 01:49 PM

God Bless you Siants, all good points but I believe like bro. Andrew has stated, it's a walk by faith. sometimes we don't see things so clearly, but that's why we are to walk by faith not by sight. Be led of the Holy Spirit!

God made adam expressly for eve and eve expressly for adam. he didn't make eve and mary joe beth and have adam choose between the two he gave eve to adam and adam to eve. I believe that there is one for each person!

BroTrevor

05-09-2006, 02:59 PM

Brother Branham said you can never pray too much. Maybe you should be doing that right now instead.

Forgive my chaplainy ways...but...I wouldn't discount this very far. Have you, dear reader of this thread, PRAYED today? Are you putting the forums before the Lord? What a shame that would be.

Learn to question the sacred cows of Christendom and prove them by the Bible.

Sacred cows of Christendom... I'm SOOO going to use that some day.

"My son, both these choices please me. Which one brings you joy?"

my...

This really has started some cogs of the ol wheel turning. This coincides with some of my thoughts as I meditated on the Lord this morning. My thoughts were off topic for this thread...but...the broader picture...

Who we are...

I'm really blown away... Lord help me to hear you speak.

jtucker

05-09-2006, 03:03 PM

it's okay if it's off topic we enjoy your post er well atleast i know i do, and i gather from taking a gander at the other posts that other users do.1 keep the great posts coming

joris

05-09-2006, 03:53 PM

As far as the perfect will arguement, does everyone here really believe there is only one perfect will?

Why would there be more than one perfect will? Seeing as a perfect will is without defect or error thus has no need of change or revision or an alternate path.
God enjoys us being with Him... is it our worship (in way of singing) He wants most or praying? or bible (or message?) reading? see, He doesn't say, "ow come on, no I don't want you to pray now, please go and sing, I feel more like your singing for me at the moment" or the other way around... there's our choice alright... and maybe, us just having fun... maybe on the forum even, this probably is taking this a bit far but... if it's not taking too much of you/your attention/your time, maybe God enjoys you enjoying your time having just fun just as much at times

so there it is... now this is ofcourse something rather different than partner choice (??), but... ;) hope this makes sence somehow ;)

joris

05-09-2006, 03:55 PM

Well, Brother Branham did say if you didn't get the right "one" here you get the right "one" on the other side.
uhm?? where does he say that, what's the context, whatever? I thought Jesus said quite clear there's no marriage there like it's here (not talking about the marriage of Bride now):confused:

jtucker

05-09-2006, 03:57 PM

I would just stay in prayer and fasting about the whole thing and yes there is only one perfect will thus it being "perfect"

JoeC

05-09-2006, 04:49 PM

Why would there be more than one perfect will? Seeing as a perfect will is without defect or error thus has no need of change or revision or an alternate path.
That's what I'm saying. I'm questioning the whole traditional perfect will paradigm. I actually posed a question once to Brother Barry Coffey with the perfect - permissive concept in the premise of the question. From his reaction, I took it he didn't think it helpful too look at God' will that way.

God made adam expressly for eve and eve expressly for adam. he didn't make eve and mary joe beth and have adam choose between the two he gave eve to adam and adam to eve. I believe that there is one for each person!
This isn't a valid analogy. Adam's circumstances were entirely different from our own. It would have been rather awkward to have two women in the garden with only one man on the whole face of the earth.

I still don't understand what you are saying really. I believe we are lead by faith. That is usually too hard for people. ... Please explain how you believe this idea, or why you would even want to?
I do not disagree with you that we are led by faith. I would also search for a mate the same as you, with prayer and a earnest spirit. What we're discussing here is a technicality - not something that would drastically change the way we go about our Christian life.

We all know God has a perfect will and a permissive will, it is in the Bible.
Not to say I don't agree that those classifications exist, but to say that there is a distinct line between them and that there is only ONE sequence of events in a person's life that follows God's perfect will? I'm calling you to the mattresses on that one. Prove it.

jtucker

05-09-2006, 05:00 PM

well it is invalid in the fact that there was only one man and one woman in the garden.

Philippe

05-10-2006, 12:08 AM

Not to say I don't agree that those classifications exist, but to say that there is a distinct line between them and that there is only ONE sequence of events in a person's life that follows God's perfect will? I'm calling you to the mattresses on that one. Prove it.

Well, I would think that in many things, there is one perfect (and only one) will.... and also that often we are not in the perfect will of God (when we do things we should not).

Sometime God has a will with a way to follows but if we do not follow that way, God will uses event so that its perfect will will be done anyway. A good example is Jonas. Jonas try to go somewhere else but God used a storm and a whale to bring him where he want him to go. In fact, we also knows it was it will to uses the whale as it was a god for those peoples...

Sometimes when we do not follows His will, we have to pay a lot for it (as when brother Branham lost his first wife and daugther).

In the case of a mate, I think that if we get the wrong mate, the relationship could be harder and even in some case lead to divorce or other problems that we might have avoided if we would have been married with the one God has choose for us.

On the other hand, I do believe that it is necessary that we believe that we are in te will of God in that case as otherwise it would be hard to really love our wife (or husband) as we should.

I also think that the importance of doing the right choice depends on our calling. In particular, it seems that for ministers, God often shows both of them in a supernatural way that they should get married together. I also believe that when God requires a man to marry a virgin, it will keep the girl pure...

I do believe that God has a perfect match for me...

AndrewMichael

05-10-2006, 12:28 AM

Not to say I don't agree that those classifications exist, but to say that there is a distinct line between them and that there is only ONE sequence of events in a person's life that follows God's perfect will? I'm calling you to the mattresses on that one. Prove it.

Putting me on the spot! And I haven't even made 20 posts yet! lol

Everything I know does not come from some long ridgorous study. It comes from either experience or revelation, thus to prove it to you would be hard for me, but nonetheless I'll try.

The clear distinct line? I don't think we can understand that fully. I know I have done things that are wrong, and afterwards suffered the consequences, and then seen God work it out anyway for His purpose. This would be His permissive will. His perfect will is when I know he has revealed something to me and I do it. This has been as little as walking past my mom to go to bed, stopping at my room, walking back and hugging her telling her I love her, and then going to bed. Many examples. Do I look at every moment and see whether I'm in His perfect will or permissive? I just try to stay prayed-up and submissive to the Spirit in me, through faith of course.

Hope that at least gives some insight to what I believe. Sorry, this topic is too much God for us small mortals to prove... Need faith for this one, in my opinion.

Bradley

05-10-2006, 01:08 AM

Wow, what a discussion!! I have a question on this subject though, and would appreciate whatever input you all can give:)
On the subject of soul mates, and God's Perfect Will:
The Bible and Bro. Branham state that we were spiritual beings first, and that the femanine side was taken out of the masculine side when Adam was in the Garden of Eden; thus we have woman. If there was one spiritual being, and it was split up into ONE masculine side, and ONE femanine side, how then could there possably be more than one mate that would be the Perfect Will of God? I understand that things change with variables such as a death of a spouse, etc...But, my question is with all variables aside for the sake of simplicity:) God bless!

AndrewMichael

05-10-2006, 01:11 AM

I like that.....We really have a femine side that fits us, its just all in a woman. I see how that might make it hard to have more than one mate. Good thought!

joris

05-10-2006, 08:43 AM

Jezz

05-10-2006, 09:52 AM

how does people not getting married (like, say, Paul) fit into that if there's a perfect match for everyone, that would leave people alone and lonely (unless that match responds in the same way) :confused:
Someone getting very lonely because I wouldn't be getting married, hmm, that doesn't sound like Gods will

Matthe 19:10-12 says that some people are born to be single, or are single "for the kingdom of heaven's sake". and says "He that is able to receive it , let him recieve it". So for those people who wouldnt get lonely without their perfect match, they should stay single. There are very few people like that however.

And Brother Branham did say that would we meet our perfect match on the other side if we didnt marry them here, I'm not sure of the exact quote, I know that my pastor has mentioned it, I asked my dad who said Brother Branham did say that and it's been mentioned on this thread also. Maybe somebody else knows the quote?

Not everybody gets lonely without their perfect match, I'm not lonely :)

joris

05-10-2006, 10:10 AM

Matthe 19:10-12 says that some people are born to be single, or are single "for the kingdom of heaven's sake". and says "He that is able to receive it , let him recieve it". So for those people who wouldnt get lonely without their perfect match, they should stay single. There are very few people like that however. but I was thinking of the match - what about her? if I'm really ok as single, what about her? is she by that forced to either stay single too - or not be in His will? ;)

Angelo

05-10-2006, 02:44 PM

but I was thinking of the match - what about her? if I'm really ok as single, what about her? is she by that forced to either stay single too - or not be in His will? ;)
That I believe will still depend on her decision in life. If she won't be happy in life without the right(perfect) person for her, she can still ask God for a mate that she can be with for the rest of her life. Let's take for example Bro Branham's condition when he lost Hope, he never wanted to marry another but Hope told him to do so. Why? that is for the sake of the kids, and can we consider his second wife not the will of God? Isn't it that God was the one who directed both of them? We can never limit God's blessings and perfect will.

HotShot53

05-10-2006, 07:48 PM

That I believe will still depend on her decision in life. If she won't be happy in life without the right(perfect) person for her, she can still ask God for a mate that she can be with for the rest of her life. Let's take for example Bro Branham's condition when he lost Hope, he never wanted to marry another but Hope told him to do so. Why? that is for the sake of the kids, and can we consider his second wife not the will of God? Isn't it that God was the one who directed both of them? We can never limit God's blessings and perfect will.

But if Hope was Bro. Branham's perfect match, and everyone has their own perfect match... was Medie (sp?) not married to her perfect match?

joris

05-10-2006, 07:52 PM

And Brother Branham did say that would we meet our perfect match on the other side if we didnt marry them here, I'm not sure of the exact quote, I know that my pastor has mentioned it, I asked my dad who said Brother Branham did say that and it's been mentioned on this thread also. Maybe somebody else knows the quote?
again I ask... very curious about this one :confused: does someone have the quote?

joris

05-10-2006, 07:54 PM

That I believe will still depend on her decision in life. If she won't be happy in life without the right(perfect) person for her, she can still ask God for a mate that she can be with for the rest of her life. Let's take for example Bro Branham's condition when he lost Hope, he never wanted to marry another but Hope told him to do so. Why? that is for the sake of the kids, and can we consider his second wife not the will of God? Isn't it that God was the one who directed both of them? We can never limit God's blessings and perfect will.but then there must be more than one candidate to marry, or would I just not be in God's will if I wouldn't get married
(I think, bottom line of what I try to say is, I feel as if the perfect match thingy is too simplistic)

but then again, look what we are doing - reasoning :ng_thumbd :y10: :embarrassed::misli::surrender sorry about me starting that

EllyMae

05-10-2006, 07:56 PM

God works in simplicity, it is us that makes things complicated..

joris

05-10-2006, 07:57 PM

God works in simplicity, it is us that makes things complicated..uhm true... :embarrassed:

EllyMae

05-10-2006, 08:05 PM

we ALL forget that at times...

joris

05-10-2006, 08:13 PM

yes we do
where were we? oh... I don't know, let God find out who we should marry, then we're sure we're in His will, right? :confused:

JoeC

05-10-2006, 08:15 PM

Putting me on the spot! And I haven't even made 20 posts yet! lol

Heh, you should feel special. :ok:

JoeC

05-10-2006, 08:21 PM

Why would there be more than one perfect will? Seeing as a perfect will is without defect or error thus has no need of change or revision or an alternate path.
Perfection is simply that without blemish. I can make two perfect circles (using a protractor, I'm circle deficient). If they are both without blemish, is one less perfect than the other because there's two of them? No. Perfection deals only with quality - not quantity.

God made adam expressly for eve and eve expressly for adam. he didn't make eve and mary joe beth and have adam choose between the two he gave eve to adam and adam to eve. I believe that there is one for each person!
well it is invalid in the fact that there was only one man and one woman in the garden.

It's invalid in the fact that the analogy has enough dissimilarities to render it unsuitable. It's what those in the field of logic call a "false analogy."

For Fun:

An analogy is a comparison between two otherwise dissimilar things based upon similarities. Analogies generally are used to persuade. A is like B in respect to P, therefore what applies to A applies to B (and vise versa).

A false analogy arises when there are relevent dissimilarities or not enough similarities between the items being compared.

Example of an analogy with relevent dissimilarities:

"When water is poured on top of a pile of rocks, it always trickles down to the rocks on the bottom. Similarly, when rich people make lots of money, we can expect this money to trickle down to the poor."

JoeC

05-10-2006, 08:29 PM

But if Hope was Bro. Branham's perfect match, and everyone has their own perfect match... was Medie (sp?) not married to her perfect match?
On first glance, some may say that all wrongs will be made right - so whoever was the mix up will be placed with the right one over there. BUT, Brother Branham had a vision where he went to heaven and Hope came up and took hold of one of his arms and Medie the other. :y10: ???

I think the life lesson that we can take home with us is that the answers aren't so simple as we'd like to make them out to be. Honestly, and I speak from experience, this is where the shortcomings of black and white thinking begin to be highlighted.

Let's take a side trail off the path of discussion. We've talked about being in the perfect and permissive as well as being out of the will of God. This clearly divides things into right or wrong, moral or immoral (permissive being still a little sketchy). Pretty black and white definition. Anybody hold that there are things that are amoral? Neither right nor wrong?

JMG

05-10-2006, 11:09 PM

Perfection is simply that without blemish. I can make two perfect circles (using a protractor, I'm circle deficient). If they are both without blemish, is one less perfect than the other because there's two of them? No. Perfection deals only with quality - not quantity.
"

But in dealing with a perfect will is it a quality or a quantity?
In the instance of a perfect circle there are infinitly many (which depends on your point of view; did the circle exist before it was drawn or does it only exist after it is drawn), but what about the perfect will of God? Is there one and only one, or infinitly many?
Infinitly many perfect wills leads to a curious interpretation of quantum mechanics; the many worlds interpretation. The many worlds interpretation of quantum mechanics is a convention that states that every possible outcome of an event occurs. One outcome happens in our universe, and the remaining outcomes occur in parallel universes that are similar to our universe except for the outcome of the specific event.
However, I only believe that there is only one perfect will of God since He knows all things that will ever happen.

JoeC

05-10-2006, 11:27 PM

Infinitly many perfect wills leads to a curious interpretation of quantum mechanics; the many worlds interpretation. The many worlds interpretation of quantum mechanics is a convention that states that every possible outcome of an event occurs. One outcome happens in our universe, and the remaining outcomes occur in parallel universes that are similar to our universe except for the outcome of the specific event.
Yes, but bubble theory also proposes that though there were infinitely many worlds (ie universes) created, only a few stabilized. This has nothing to do with perfection. I'm guessing that the "many worlds" of quantum physics have similar imperfections.

I only believe that there is only one perfect will of God since He knows all things that will ever happen.

The statement above says that if God knows all things then He has one perfect will. This seems to imply that either God prescripted His will according to what happens or what happens follows His perfect will exactly. We know the latter isn't true, because there's plenty of things that have happened that, though God worked them out to His good pleasure, the events themselves were out of His will.

As for the former (God prescripting His will according to what happens), God's very sovereignty is compromised by such a belief.

Anyhow, I don't want us to go off on a tangent. Tell me what your reaction was to my last post. Please.

JMG

05-10-2006, 11:47 PM

The statement above says that if God knows all things then He has one perfect will. This seems to imply that either God prescripted His will according to what happens or what happens follows His perfect will exactly. We know the latter isn't true, because there's plenty of things that have happened that, though God worked them out to His good pleasure, the events themselves were out of His will.

As for the former (God prescripting His will according to what happens), God's very sovereignty is compromised by such a belief.

Anyhow, I don't want us to go off on a tangent. Tell me what your reaction was to my last post. Please.

What I am getting at is that since God has always known everything that will ever happen is it to restrictive to say that God has one perfect will?

JoeC

05-10-2006, 11:52 PM

I think it is... I don't see how God's foreknowledge would affect His perfect will. It could even broaden it - seeing all the possibilities. But by going this route, the case can be made either way and we're going to go in circles.

Let's take a side trail off the path of discussion. We've talked about being in the perfect and permissive as well as being out of the will of God. This clearly divides things into right or wrong, moral or immoral (permissive being still a little sketchy). Pretty black and white definition. Anybody hold that there are things that are amoral? Neither right nor wrong?

AndrewMichael

05-10-2006, 11:55 PM

Wow guys!! I am just not philosophical enough for this discussion!! I'll see ya back on the lifting thread! lol

JoeC

05-10-2006, 11:58 PM

Awww. Your contributions were appreciated. I'm gonna go pout now... :(

Jezz

05-11-2006, 08:53 AM

The only person to ever live a life in the perfect will of God 100% of the time was Jesus. Now if he had done anything different in his life would he have followed the perfect will of God? Perhaps... if Jesus had eaten bread and fish for dinner one night instead of bread and cheese, would that have mattered? he was hungry, so he ate. We long to have a mate, so we go find one, does it matter which mate we choose? (aside from the criteria we already have set down for us in Bible and from Brother Branham). I'm not sure which side of the argument is true, until I or somebody else can find that quote of Brother Branhams I'll keep my mind open.

Bradley

05-11-2006, 08:59 AM

Wow! There's really a lot of different angles that this is being approached by! I really like the angle of some things being "amoral," neither right nor wrong.......To be quite honest, I do not forsee any of us actually having an answer, altho everyone is quite intelligent...I think the discussion is too broad......We might want to take each scenario one by one to discuss if anything is "amoral". From my point of view, the things that are black and white in the Bible or in the Message, are black and white to me....Like having more than one wife at the same time..That's pretty "cut and dry"...But, the things that the Bible or the Message leave up to me to make the choice, then I make a choice....altho I seek God's will on that as well. But, as far as there being only one perfect mate for a person...unless the person is plannin on marrying more than one person, then the discussion is kind of irrellivant.....seeing as you'll only marry one person weather or not three people would've been just fine for you to marry....
I hope that I am able to do as good as the others on bringing a new angle to the table:) God bless you all!

JoeC

05-11-2006, 09:15 AM

From my point of view, the things that are black and white in the Bible or in the Message, are black and white to me....But, as far as there being only one perfect mate for a person...the discussion is kind of irrellivant.....seeing as you'll only marry one person weather or not three people would've been just fine for you to marry....
Here here! I do agree. The discussion really is just for fun (though I do think there are some life lessons woven into it). I'm sure that each of us, provided that we seek God over the matter and choose wisely, will marry in the will of God - whether there's only one right choice for us or many. I don't think people should get intimidated or fearful over the possibility of there being only one right mate for them. It certainly isn't a thing that should freeze you in your tracks, making you unable to do anything. Brother Branham said try a shot in the gun and see if it fires. It's a real practical approach. If you stay prayed up and neutral, I'm sure God will let you know if you go outside his perfect will.

joris

05-11-2006, 01:24 PM

Infinitly many perfect wills leads to a curious interpretation of quantum mechanics; the many worlds interpretation.that interpretation is flawed (as it says at whatever point of time you will choose to do either A and B; now try applying that to the garden of Getsemane and you'll see it's flawed ;))
I think a much better interpretation is, quantum mechanics has something to do with free will - not with "in some universe I'll choose the right way, in some other I'll choose the wrong way"

JMG

05-11-2006, 02:47 PM

that interpretation is flawed (as it says at whatever point of time you will choose to do either A and B; now try applying that to the garden of Getsemane and you'll see it's flawed ;))
I think a much better interpretation is, quantum mechanics has something to do with free will - not with "in some universe I'll choose the right way, in some other I'll choose the wrong way"

The many worlds interpretation of quantum mechanics is only one of several quantum mechanical interpretations.
The mainstream view of quantum mechanics is the copenhagen interpretation (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Copenhagen_interpretation).
The reason that there are different interpretations of quantum mechanics is that no one knows exactly what quantum mechanics is talking about (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Interpretation_of_quantum_mechanics).
Simply put, scientist do not understand what quantum mechanics is, they only understand the mathematics of quantum mechanics.

JoeC

05-11-2006, 06:13 PM

Brother Branham said you can never pray too much. Maybe you should be doing that right now instead.
Forgive my chaplainy ways...but...I wouldn't discount this very far. Have you, dear reader of this thread, PRAYED today? Are you putting the forums before the Lord? What a shame that would be.
I just want to go on record here by saying I wasn't at all discounting prayer. I was merely highlighting the fact that, for most of us, there's almost always something more godly we could be doing. Praying four hours today and only being on the forums for one is certainly more godly than praying for three hours today and being on the forums for two hours. However, I would be slow to accuse the person of the latter being less in the perfect will of God than the person who does the former. Does anyone see what I'm getting at?

jtucker

05-11-2006, 08:20 PM

We never know the path God has for another, nor what that person is led by the lord to do unless revelead to us by them or God! so yes i understand what your saying!

JoeC

05-11-2006, 10:47 PM

I know there are a lot of people who have been reading this thread and just thinking it over. Now's the time to bring it to the polls. Step right up and let us know what you think - for curiosities' sake. Simply use the poll at the top of this page.

JoeC

05-11-2006, 11:19 PM

Jezz

05-12-2006, 09:17 AM

As an aside, isn't this sort of topic so much more interesting on the forums than on Xanga? I'm not trying to boost YQF's reputation, but here's how I see it:

Everyday stuff, what happened to me, etc. That's cool on Xanga.

Spiritual stuff - really anything that could make for discussion - is cool on the forums. Cause commenting just doesn't lead into fulfilling conversations.

Of course, the everyday stuff is cool on the forums too. ;)

I agree, YQF is great, especially the Study Hall section. The discussion of the Word amongst the youth of my church is pretty much non-existent so I am especially thankful to have found this place (well I didnt find it, Sarah told me about it).

Angelo

05-12-2006, 10:26 AM

I agree too Joe. You guys are a real blessing.

AndrewMichael

05-12-2006, 10:32 AM

Ya, these things are pretty cool... Glad that I could join!

blessed

05-12-2006, 10:33 AM

awwwww... you guys make me pull out the box of tissue :cry:

JoeC

05-12-2006, 11:21 AM

blessed, your such a clown sometimes. :)

AndrewMichael

05-12-2006, 12:38 PM

Well, being Andrew I have to say this..... it's all in love of course.

I still don't understand how we are coming to the conclusion that we have something to do with picking our mate if God already ordained for us a mate. I know we don't believe in polygamy. The only way I can see having more than one is if our first mate dies and we remarry another. But I believe God ordains this too, and we know that Brother Branham did not want to marry Meda, he was commisioned by God to do it.

"Who God hath put together" I see this as completely out of the hands of man. I firmly believe that the reason we choose our mate should be completely revelation, not looks, feelings, popularity, or whatevermore but assurdly "God wants me to do this!"

To say that we have some sort of choice in the manner (if we are really seeking the Lord's guidance) is likened unto Ahab and Ramoth-Gilead. That girl/guy can be everything we like, 100% genuine believer, a completely fundamental but for us to pursue a relationship might be completely anit-christ. Two months ago I probably wouldn't have said that, but I experienced this firsthand and know its the truth. We MUST act by revelation and thus to say there is more than one possible outcome for finding the right mate would cause two perfect wills, which I'm sorry, but that seems like an oxymoron, contradicting itself.

Let me know (and try to keep quantum physics out of it lol)

JoeC

05-12-2006, 01:03 PM

"Who God hath put together" I see this as completely out of the hands of man. I firmly believe that the reason we choose our mate should be completely revelation, not looks, feelings, popularity, or whatevermore but assurdly "God wants me to do this!"

According to Paul, it would seem that we have the option to either marry or not to marry:
I CORINTHIANS 7:8
I say therefore to the unmarried and widows, It is good for them if they abide even as I.
I CORINTHIANS 7:9
But if they cannot contain, let them marry: for it is better to marry than to burn.

So there is an evident choice in that matter (though some may feel they can't help themselves but to get married ;) ). Given that there is a choice involved in whether we even get married or not, it would seem to follow that once we make the choice to get married we would have the choice as to whom we marry.

So where does God putting together a couple (Matthew 19:6) fit in? This seems to me that it has more to do with God putting his blessing on their marriage and them being joined in holy matrimony under the His name.

I don't say that it's out of God's realm to specially select a mate for me - he could do it, for sure! Perhaps He knows that there is only one out there that would perfectly complement me. But I don't see a case for this being the set way that God deals with people. Could be. I just don't see it. If it's there, I trust God will open my eyes to it. Either way, I believe that if I consecrate myself to Him I will marry in His will - whether the options are multiple or just one. One thing is for sure - it's not a thing that makes a huge difference in our Christian walk. It's fun to discuss, maybe even enlightening, but nothing so important that one should split fellowship over. I don't want to be accused of causing division and I trust everyone here is keeping this in perspective with the big picture.

AndrewMichael

05-12-2006, 01:10 PM

I CORINTHIANS 7:8
I say therefore to the unmarried and widows, It is good for them if they abide even as I.
I CORINTHIANS 7:9
But if they cannot contain, let them marry: for it is better to marry than to burn.

I believe that the above scriptures are completely revelation as well. We can seek and find out if God wants us to be single or not. I have found out that I don't think I will remain single. I would deem that a wonderous blessing, but I believe our chose should be completely submissive, thus not us chosing by our own thoughts, but by His revelation. I guess I see that if were the one's who chose (being in the will of God), then we would be able to take credit. I only want to give God all the credit because without Him we are dirt.

(And yes, the last thing I want is to split fellowship, that's just dumb!)

JoeC

05-12-2006, 01:16 PM

(And yes, the last thing I want is to split fellowship, that's just dumb!)
Unfortunately, this is the exact kind of minuscule thing that many churches do split over. :ng_thumbd

joris

05-12-2006, 03:19 PM

Simply put, scientist do not understand what quantum mechanics is, they only understand the mathematics of quantum mechanics.which shows our minds are too limited to understand Gods creation...
anyway, yeah, quantum mechanics is too weird; it's just where reality doesn't fit into logic anymore (logic = the way people think - if it is "sound" anyway - nothing more; certainly not something as great as people seem to think)

JMG

05-12-2006, 03:28 PM

which shows our minds are too limited to understand Gods creation...
anyway, yeah, quantum mechanics is too weird; it's just where reality doesn't fit into logic anymore (logic = the way people think - if it is "sound" anyway - nothing more; certainly not something as great as people seem to think)

Ah, but the weirdness of quantum mechanics is what makes quantum mechanics exciting. For since when has God ever fit into human logic? :)

joris

05-12-2006, 03:32 PM

all in all... yeah it's something interesting to think of, but... well, yeah, I agree revelation on whether to have a relationship with someone is most important :)
I don't know too well about relationships or so - I just hope those of my friends are guided by God, being in God's will; I may ask them :)
still - the fact that people may remarry, God recommending this even... I chose the second option because of that

Bradley

05-12-2006, 05:45 PM

Philippe

05-13-2006, 12:36 AM

I chose the second for that reason too....If a spouse dies, then you can remarry, and if you're led of God to do so, then both spouses are pleasing to him....Altho, I lean more twards there only being one "soul mate".....but more than one person may be a good mate...

Well, the 2 choices we are given are not totally exclusive... I somewhat find that the first choice apply better to my point of view but I do believe that all God's children are pleasing to Him...

JoeC

05-13-2006, 01:05 AM

I agree. I probably should have provided more options or made the existing options broader. Sry.

jtucker

05-13-2006, 01:43 AM

yeah well it's okay we won't martyr you for it lol because where would we be without our peerless polymath

EllyMae

05-24-2006, 12:21 AM

Well, the 2 choices we are given are not totally exclusive... I somewhat find that the first choice apply better to my point of view but I do believe that all God's children are pleasing to Him...

I was going to explain myself why I voted the way I did, but I pretty much agree with what Bradley said as well.

JMC_785

05-26-2006, 08:03 PM

Wow Josiah, leave it to you to create such a diverse topic for contemplation.:) My opinion? God's will is his word, and all his requirements for ANY circumstances lay therein. God's clearly outlines HIS requirements for EVERY situation, and EVERYTHING that is God's will runs in perfect continuity with his word. It isn't given to us to determine God's will of our own accord, it's up to us to BELIEVE God's word regardless of how we feel about it. I'm sure that the Old-Testament oddballs (as the outside world might see them anyways) you referred to might have had some qualms themselves about what they were doing, but God called them to do it and it's not for us to question. If God calls ANYONE to do something outside the bounds of what I think is right, I don't have any right to disrespect it, no matter what my opinion might be. Myself, I think that there truly is only one right mate for any one person, if only God alone is that mate, that's the way it is, some people are called to that. Following the guidelines established in God's word is the ONLY way to find a suitable candidate to be one's helpmate, after that prayer and seeking God with enough humility to obey him despite what you may want, is the only way to find the ONE true partner that God PREDISTINATED you to. There of course could be multiple candidates without question, all with presumably equal qualification. Free will of course enters into the equasion now, so do you pick a candidate and say, "God this is the one I want!" or do you say, "Lord, which one is the right one for me, you know MY own desires, but which one do YOU want me to have?" Just my 2 cents worth....

JoeC

05-26-2006, 09:25 PM

You may have something, Matt. I'm not entirely convinced on either side, and the whole free will thing really complicates the "equation." Anyhow, it was a fun topic. ;)

JMC_785

05-26-2006, 10:01 PM

Indeed it was, interesting one at that. The polls are 50/50, I wonder how it will end?

AndrewMichael

05-27-2006, 12:15 AM

Of course, in most discussions, the right answer is niether of the two choices given...

Here's how I believe it. We might recall Brother Branham walking into the gates of Heaven (something to that order) and having both of his wives in his arms... This is pretty much were I believe the curveball comes in.

I believe there is only one perfect person for a specific time. Right now, if I am to be with someone, there is only one mate that God predestinated. But, if she would die, and God would have predestinated another mate, then that would give me two wives. I don't believe it would have been ok if Brother Branham would have married Medie first and then Hope, God placed it for that order, perfectly predestinated. For us to say we can have a choice in the matter takes God out of it, at least in my opinion. We must recognize that a girl may be 100% filled with the Holy Ghost, sweet, kind, lovely, cute, etc. etc. and for me to pursue a relationship with her could be completely anti-christ, and yes I have experienced this first-hand. We definitely should look into the Word first to see if the person's life is truly centered around Christ, but we must recieve a revelation that God wants us to pursue it, or we can get out of His will.

God has one Will and one way, if we will only submit to it.

JMC_785

05-29-2006, 08:44 PM

Very valid point I would imagine, I was always under the impression that over there they wouldn't be your wife though. Am I the only one who believes that my wife here will only be my sister in christ over there?

Blood Washed Bride

05-29-2006, 09:18 PM

No, I believe that to be the case, as well. Although there are times I wish it wasn't so and that my husband and I would continue to share that bond for all eternity.

BroTrevor

05-29-2006, 11:15 PM

but what about....

And when a man loves a woman and marries her because she's just pretty, there'll be an end to that. But when a man finds a woman that he loves, he don't know why, but he loves her... And she finds the man that she loves, no matter what he looks like... He loves her. She loves him. That's an eternal mate in glory. They'll... Death nor nothing else can ever separate them. Because they are from eternity, and they stepped out into space of time, and will return back to eternity. Eternity has dropped down in a body called time, then it goes right back up into eternity again. It cannot perish.

Philippe

05-29-2006, 11:30 PM

That's an eternal mate in glory

I really like that one ! It give a greater meanning to the marriage as we want to find the one that is a part of us and share the eternity with her.

God'schild

07-10-2006, 05:23 PM

i need to correct JoeC

Sorry

But the Bible says that the Footsteps of the Righteous are order of the Lord.

joris

07-10-2006, 07:26 PM

But the Bible says that the Footsteps of the Righteous are order of the Lord.what do you mean there really? ow... or could you search for the relevant text/texts please, that'd be great :)

God'schild

07-10-2006, 07:30 PM

i will find the scripture for you joris

and post it when i have found it.

God'schild

07-10-2006, 08:19 PM

what do you mean there really? ow... or could you search for the relevant text/texts please, that'd be great :)

Joris

If your a child of God your footsteps are order of God, God knows exactly what your going to do. He directs if your his child.

does that explain it or does it still confuse you??

Sorry i'm not very good at explaing things.

joris

07-11-2006, 08:21 AM

If your a child of God your footsteps are order of God, God knows exactly what your going to do. He directs if your his child. :) yes
(though in all that He respects free will and such; yeah he teaches us to choose right too)
though I'm not certain of, what did JoeC say that needed to be corrected? :y10:

HotShot53

07-11-2006, 03:08 PM

Lol, I was just looking at who voted for what on the above poll.... everyone who voted for the "could be more than one" option is currently single...while around half of those voting for the "there is only one" are currently not really single... wonder if that has anything to do with how they voted?

joris

07-11-2006, 03:14 PM

wonder if that has anything to do with how they voted?I don't really get it; what is your idea about that?

HotShot53

07-11-2006, 03:29 PM

I don't really get it; what is your idea about that?

Inotherwords, those of us who are still single aren't really sure if there is only one person out there for us, but those who seem to have found their "soulmate" all voted that there is only one.

joris

07-11-2006, 03:34 PM

Inotherwords, those of us who are still single aren't really sure if there is only one person out there for us, but those who seem to have found their "soulmate" all voted that there is only one.that much I understood :rollseyes:
I thought you meant you had some great idea about the reason for that? :smiley:

HotShot53

07-11-2006, 03:38 PM

that much I understood :rollseyes:
I thought you meant you had some great idea about the reason for that? :smiley:

Lol, my theory is that once you find your "soulmate" you don't think there is anyone else out there for you, so naturally you'd vote for there being only one perfect mate... but if you haven't found your "soulmate" yet, we aren't really sure. I just found the voting breakdown interesting.

God'schild

07-11-2006, 04:18 PM

Lol, my theory is that once you find your "soulmate" you don't think there is anyone else out there for you, so naturally you'd vote for there being only one perfect mate... but if you haven't found your "soulmate" yet, we aren't really sure. I just found the voting breakdown interesting.

LOL:yay: :yay:

Well what if you are still single but know who your soul mate is???
:confused: :confused:

Angelo

07-11-2006, 05:55 PM

Uhm, make sure your assumed soulmate don't find another soulmate? :misli:

God'schild

07-11-2006, 05:59 PM

i know he won't

JoeC

07-11-2006, 06:43 PM

Philippe

07-11-2006, 08:52 PM

i know he won't

Well, I tend to agree with you but at the same time I do not understand some situations where a boy loves a girl thinking she is her mate while she does not seems to be enough interested...

Or a girl that would have like a brother and he does not seems to love her more that just being friends.

Also, I do not understand how a person that believe to knows her mate would handle the situation if that person ever decide to marry someone else...

God'schild

07-11-2006, 09:19 PM

let's just say that i know that the person i love is going to be my future husband.

already bought

07-13-2006, 01:38 AM

well if he married or she married some one eles and that was the one God had for you then would that really be the one God had for you or only the one you thought God had for you??

joris

07-13-2006, 05:13 PM

well if he married or she married some one eles and that was the one God had for you then would that really be the one God had for you or only the one you thought God had for you??
(or maybe you'd just need to wait for an awful amount of more time :y10:)

already bought

07-13-2006, 08:25 PM

could be a life time of waiting

blessed

07-20-2006, 05:49 PM

:d
........................

already bought

07-20-2006, 08:27 PM

:d
........................

Don't worry sister. In God time He will bring the right one two you. There must be some one mighty speical for you to keep you waiting this long. On thing I really like I don't know where I got it from but I really like it.
The longer it takes for a mirical to happen that Greater it is.

God'schild

07-20-2006, 11:16 PM

The longer it takes for a mirical to happen that Greater it is.

I like that........
that's true.........

Nomes

03-28-2007, 03:58 AM

I think there's many people you could be compatible with. That a marriage would work for.

But there's one who would be perfect.

joris

03-28-2007, 07:15 AM

I think there's many people you could be compatible with. That a marriage would work for.

But there's one who would be perfect.but what do you base that on?
Is it Genesis 2 (seems weak as a promise, kinda indirect, to say the least)? or what is it based on? :confused:

Nomes

03-28-2007, 08:52 AM

I don't base it on anything.

It's just my thoughts.

Biblically speaking yeah, God has created a perfect other for each person.

But I still think you could make a marriage work with other people.

marichino_freedom

03-28-2007, 01:31 PM

absolutely. i agree. sort of like people who had arranged marriages and "grew to love" the other over time.

joris

03-29-2007, 12:14 PM

absolutely. i agree. sort of like people who had arranged marriages and "grew to love" the other over time.uhm that's what happened for ages, for example, that's how Isaak got his wife -- note he didn't go search for a girlfriend/bride himself, a servant of his father got one for him
different story for Jakob... kinda; though he got the wife he longed for, he got three other wifes as well - the older sister Lea (kinda "interesting" he got married without noticing it's not the wife you want to be married to... can't imagine how that went actually) and the slaves as they at some point didn't get children, and wanted to get these slaves to get the children for them (The case of Lea sounds like quite sad, her feeling unloved, being unloved, her getting children, and miserably hoping maybe that would make Jakob love her)

The thing of dating (or not dating, but anyway choosing your partner yourself) is western, modern - it's our culture (not that I'd like to have it different)

TommyLewis

03-31-2007, 05:25 AM

I believe we have a perfect preordained match...
I guess we could "make it work" with others...but we may be slipping into the permissive will of God to do so...

Angelo

03-31-2007, 01:58 PM

What about David and Batsheba? Do you think they we're predestinated since Solomon came from their union?

joris

03-31-2007, 03:37 PM

I believe we have a perfect preordained match...
I guess we could "make it work" with others...but we may be slipping into the permissive will of God to do so...again I ask, is there something you actually base that on? :confused: (that's a question that's bugging me...)

Nate

03-31-2007, 03:55 PM

I'll tell you what I know. I don't know anything at all. Where women are concerned, I can only say I want to get it right the first time, because God doesn't like do-overs.

AlanaH

03-31-2007, 03:59 PM

I agree. In the Message, you don't exactly get another chance to get it right.

EllyMae

03-31-2007, 04:13 PM

again I ask, is there something you actually base that on? :confused: (that's a question that's bugging me...)

Well Joris, think of this way.

The bible teaches (if you want me to find the exact scripture I can), that for a man to even look at woman to lust after, he has already committed adultery in his heart. So, adultery isn't some slight thing. Also, Mark 10:11-12 says, "And he saith unto them, Whosoever shall put away his wife, and marry another, committeth adultery against her. And if a woman shall put away her husband, and be married to another, she committeth adultery." What I'm trying to say is, we're only to get married ONE time. Although, there are certain circumstances should your spouse die, that it's acceptable. Because if we do get remarried with our "ex"-spouse alive, then we're committing adultery. Just as Jesus as a predesintated Bride, we also have someone who is predestinated just for us.

Philippe

03-31-2007, 04:58 PM

What about David and Batsheba? Do you think they we're predestinated since Solomon came from their union?

Weel, I have heard that David have not wait till it was the time...

If he would add wait, then probably Uri would have died and then David could take her as his wife.

AlanaH

03-31-2007, 05:12 PM

I have always thought that there was only one perfect match. Anyone else might be the permissable, but not the perfect. And if you get the permissable, then someone else is missing their perfect as well. It's a chain reaction.

joris

03-31-2007, 06:54 PM

I wasn't asking about getting second chances, or about adultery; no clue where you got the impression that I was asking that <No need to find me the scriptures - it's in Mathew 5, no trouble to find that>

Skirty

03-31-2007, 07:02 PM

I have always believed there is one person you are meant to be with... there are circumstances when one of the spouses dies and the other remarries, that I believe were meant to be as well.
I dont think God has more than one person at a time for you though. Does that make sense? lol.

That is simply my opinion, no scriptures to back it up or to say otherwise... at least I couldnt find any.

joris

04-02-2007, 07:16 AM

I dont think God has more than one person at a time for you though. Does that make sense?if you are an elder, you shouldn't have more than one wife - Bible explicitly tells that. that seems an awfully weak statement however; the whole fact that bible mentions this, and mentions this about elders, specifically, might well implies it wasn't that strange back then to be married to more than one wife. (it doesn't seem to make much sence to think of this to mean a man should be married to be an elder)

leahmb

04-02-2007, 01:41 PM

I dont think God has more than one person at a time for you though. Does that make sense?

Perfect sense! We had been discussing this before you posted this...my conclusion was that, there can only be 1 perfect person at a given time, but in a lifetime a person may have more than 1 in the event someone passes away.

I can think of an instance of someone who remarried after their spouse passed away and both wives (at least to me) seem to have been/be the 'right one.' But if he had married the 2nd one when he married the 1st one, it wouldn't have been the right one.

I also think there could be more than 1 person that it could 'work out' with, but like someone mentioned, I believe that would be God's permissive will, rather than his perfect will.

marichino_freedom

04-02-2007, 01:42 PM

Well Joris, think of this way.

The bible teaches (if you want me to find the exact scripture I can), that for a man to even look at woman to lust after, he has already committed adultery in his heart. So, adultery isn't some slight thing. Also, Mark 10:11-12 says, "And he saith unto them, Whosoever shall put away his wife, and marry another, committeth adultery against her. And if a woman shall put away her husband, and be married to another, she committeth adultery." What I'm trying to say is, we're only to get married ONE time. Although, there are certain circumstances should your spouse die, that it's acceptable. Because if we do get remarried with our "ex"-spouse alive, then we're committing adultery. Just as Jesus as a predesintated Bride, we also have someone who is predestinated just for us.

ok....how about this though? say two people are married as non-believers, become believers, but their spouses do not. the still non-believing spouses divorce the new believers and then these two believers find each other and get married.

that wrong? i dont think so.

blessed

04-02-2007, 02:31 PM

ok....how about this though? say two people are married as non-believers, become believers, but their spouses do not. the still non-believing spouses divorce the new believers and then these two believers find each other and get married.

that wrong? i dont think so.

Let me understand before I comment. Two people get married, 1 believer the other is not. Then they divorce.. and the believer gets married to another believer who is in the same situation.

Well according to my understand of the Word that is wrong.. only if both spouses die then the other spouse can remarry other than that its adultuery.

edit -----

I can't find the specific quote that im looking for but hope this help. I will keep lookign for it

THE.RESULTS.OF.DECISION_ CHICAGO.IL SATURDAY_ 55-1008
E-53 Oh, my. Yeah, he got them all mixed up out there, and begin to marry, intermarry. That's the way they did today, when you got to wandering around. If you'd stayed on the real firing line of God, you wouldn't have done these things. Marrying believers with unbelievers, and in and out, and so forth, and marrying them that had been married two or three times and had three or four wives, and so forth, and marry them again. That's that old doctrine of Balaam. That's right

marichino_freedom

04-02-2007, 02:52 PM

actually, neither were believers when they got married, only when they re-married.

blessed

04-02-2007, 02:57 PM

They became believers then re married ?

leahmb

04-02-2007, 03:24 PM

Matthew 5:32 "But I say unto you, That whosoever shall put away his wife, saving for the cause of fornication, causeth her to commit adultery: and whosoever shall marry her that is divorced committeth adultery. "

AlanaH

04-02-2007, 03:49 PM

That's a huge issue in our church because it's happened before.

I personally don't think it's right for them to remarry. It also cuts off the chances of the other coming into the Message and them getting back together. I don't see it happening, and I know that our ministry do not support it.

marichino_freedom

04-02-2007, 04:47 PM

it was their spouses that divorced them (the non believers divorced the believers)

marichino_freedom

04-02-2007, 04:55 PM

1 Corinthians 7:

10 Now to the married I command, yet not I but the Lord: A wife is not to depart from her husband. 11 But even if she does depart, let her remain unmarried or be reconciled to her husband. And a husband is not to divorce his wife.
12 But to the rest I, not the Lord, say: If any brother has a wife who does not believe, and she is willing to live with him, let him not divorce her. 13 And a woman who has a husband who does not believe, if he is willing to live with her, let her not divorce him. 14 For the unbelieving husband is sanctified by the wife, and the unbelieving wife is sanctified by the husband; otherwise your children would be unclean, but now they are holy. 15 But if the unbeliever departs, let him depart; a brother or a sister is not under bondage in such cases. But God has called us to peace. 16 For how do you know, O wife, whether you will save your husband? Or how do you know, O husband, whether you will save your wife?

blessed

04-02-2007, 04:57 PM

It does not say anywhere there that the person should remarry.

Angelo

04-02-2007, 05:04 PM

That's a big problem. Basically, being believers they should have known that they couldn't marry again in the first place because their first husbands/wives still live.

Angelo

04-02-2007, 05:12 PM

Weel, I have heard that David have not wait till it was the time...

If he would add wait, then probably Uri would have died and then David could take her as his wife.
Yeah, it is possible. Should David waited and prayed unto the Lord to help him get over the temptation, he couldn't have made the mistake. Prayer then is really important regarding this matter.

marichino_freedom

04-02-2007, 05:39 PM

That's a big problem. Basically, being believers they should have known that they couldn't marry again in the first place because their first husbands/wives still live.

but since it says that they are not under "bondage" in such cases, and they TRIED to work it out with their spouses, but the spouses left anyway, i dont see why they can't get married to each other. they are both believers (now, they weren't when they were first married)......

this is a real-life scenario.....some of my close friends.

Nate

04-02-2007, 05:44 PM

blessed

04-02-2007, 05:46 PM

If its done already nothing can be done about it... but I think most of us was referring to the question more of "Is it ok to do it".

leahmb

04-02-2007, 05:46 PM

I think "bondage' is in reference to the fact that they aren't forced to stay together. I don't have the scriptures handy, but it's clearly laid out (to me at least) that a divorced woman can NEVER remarry and a divorced man only can if the divorce was due to adultery on the former wife's part. But that gets extremely sticky......

vpiper

04-02-2007, 06:24 PM

In The Fort, Andrew indicated that he believed there is only one girl for one guy (or, if the order matters to you, one guy for one girl).

What do others feel about this? Is there a pre-ordained match for each believer? Or does the mate just have to meet certain criteria of character and personality to complement you?

Let's open up the lines. And the first caller is...

We just talked about this on wednesday night at bible study.
(this was in the 6th seal)
Bro Branham had two wives, one at a time, but when he had a vision about going to heaven he had both of his wives with him when he walked in.

I believe God has a plan for you and a right mate for the moment you are in.

JMG

04-02-2007, 08:44 PM

it was their spouses that divorced them (the non believers divorced the believers)

Eventhough though their unbelieving spouse used the law of the land to be completely and totally seperated from them, at what point in God's eyes did they become unmarried to the spouse who is using the law of the land to be completely and totally seperated from them?

marichino_freedom

04-03-2007, 02:18 PM

I'm of the opinion that what's done is done, and there's no point in questioning it's morality. So long as they stay where they're at now, there's grace enough for them.

Even if it were wrong, what should they do? Get devorced? Again? C'mon. That's life. Move on.

good point. its done, its over with.....moving on in their lives.

my mom doesnt believe how i do, but i am still happy for her getting married this upcoming saturday....

BroTrevor

04-04-2007, 01:24 AM

"From the beginning it was not so"

MARRIAGE.AND.DIVORCE_ JEFF.IN V-3 N-13 SUNDAY_ 65-0221M
But I say unto you, That whosoever shall put away his wife, saving... the cause of fornication, causes her to commit adultery:... (See?)... whosoever shall put away his wife, saving... the cause of fornication, causes her to commit adultery:... (Why? She'll marry again.)... and whosoever... marries her that is divorced committed adultery.
MARRIAGE.AND.DIVORCE_ JEFF.IN V-3 N-13 SUNDAY_ 65-0221M
37-1 See, she's got a living husband, so no man can marry her. Care what she does and who she is, she's got a living husband. There's no grounds for her at all. But it's not for him: causes her, not him. Get it? You have to make the Word run in continuity. See? Nothing saying he couldn't, but she can't. See? 'Causes her, not him. That's just exactly what the Bible says. "Causes her..." It is not stated against him to remarry, but her. Why?
Christ in the type. Notice, it is stated that he cannot remarry, only a virgin. He can remarry; he can marry--he can remarry again if it's a virgin; but he can't marry somebody's else's wife. No, indeedy. And if he does marry a divorced woman, he is living in adultery; I don't care who he is. The Bible said, "Whosoever marries her that is put away, liveth in adultery." There you are, not no divorcee.

MARRIAGE.AND.DIVORCE_ JEFF.IN V-3 N-13 SUNDAY_ 65-0221M
48-6 And in I Corinthians the--the 7th chapter, the 12th and 15th verse in the New Testament prophet, Paul, who met the same thing in the church and spoke this: "This is I, not the Lord." Is that right? Because of the divorce condition.
It wasn't so from the beginning. But Moses was permitted it, and God recognized it righteousness. And Paul also had a right when he found his church in that condition.
Now, you believe this to be true and believe it to come from God. And by the vindication of His Cloud and His Message that's brought me this far, should not God upon the mountain permit me to do the same thing to suffer you to go on the way you are and do it no more. Go with your wives and live in peace, for the hour is late. The coming of the Lord is at hand. We haven't got time to break these things up. Don't you dare try to do it again. I'm speaking only to my congregation. But if you are married--and God bore me witness to that on the mountain that I could say this (a supernatural revelation because of the opening of the Seven Seals and this is a question in God's Word): let them go on in as they are and sin no more.
MARRIAGE.AND.DIVORCE_ JEFF.IN V-3 N-13 SUNDAY_ 65-0221M
49-1 It wasn't so from the beginning. That is right. It wasn't so, and it will not be at the end.

continuing on a bit later...

So under the modern conditions, I command you to go to your home with your wife now. If you are happy with her, live with her, raise your children in the admonition of God; but God be merciful to you if you ever do that again. You teach your children to never do a thing like that. Bring them up in the admonition of God. And now that you are as you are, let us go now to late evening hour that we're living in and press towards the mark of the high calling in Christ where all things will be possible.

-------------------------

I also am happy for your mom. Even if they don't believe, it's good to know and you want to see them happy. My family doesn't believe the way I do anymore...I wish them every happiness they can find anyhow. I pray the ultimate happiness will be found sometime, and that I know is Jesus Christ.

marichino_freedom

04-04-2007, 02:19 PM

thanks bro. t! and those are great quotes.

vpiper

04-12-2007, 03:45 PM

so Back on Topic like I tried to say earlier about the fact that Brother Branham had two wives, no divorces just two wives.

How can you say there's only one Perfect Match. He loved each of them. He didn't begin loving the second one until long after the first one pasted, but they were both perfect for him for the time that they were with him.

leahmb

04-12-2007, 05:05 PM

but they were both perfect for him for the time that they were with him.

I think that's the key--the timing--only one per specific time frame.

Jezz

04-13-2007, 05:06 AM

Interesting quote I heard while listening to the Stature of A Perfect Man

I might say something here. The reason I believe... Now, someone got me all wrong here not long ago. I got a letter from the Ministerial Association that said that I believed that there was--we were soul-mated; and we must leave our companions if we're not soul-mated to them, to marry another one that we were soul-mated to. Oh, my. I said, "I'm not guilty of a heresy like that." I've always been against that. I--I don't believe in that. And certainly not. I believe that God gives us a mate; that's true. And then we become part of each other. That's right. And before a man gets married, he should think these things over; study it.

Is he saying that we have no soul-mate, or just that we shouldn't leave our current wife/husband to be with our soul-mate?

He says that we become part of each other, not that we already are.

joris

04-13-2007, 05:56 AM

Interesting quote I heard while listening to the Stature of A Perfect Man

Is he saying that we have no soul-mate, or just that we shouldn't leave our current wife/husband to be with our soul-mate?

He says that we become part of each other, not that we already are.Wait... if that's a "Thus said the Lord" (as you call it), this has to be in bible. Did he quote any bible text to back that up?

One text I just now had to think of,
Gen2:24Therefore shall a man leave his father and his mother, and shall cleave unto his wife: and they shall be one flesh.
In Dutch, the word shall cannot be mistaken from meaning future. (I mean you could replace the word shall with will without change of meaning)

BroTrevor

04-13-2007, 12:07 PM

Wait... if that's a "Thus said the Lord" (as you call it), this has to be in bible. Did he quote any bible text to back that up?

One text I just now had to think of,
Gen2:24Therefore shall a man leave his father and his mother, and shall cleave unto his wife: and they shall be one flesh.
In Dutch, the word shall cannot be mistaken from meaning future. (I mean you could replace the word shall with will without change of meaning)

I'm pretty sure that's EXACTLY what he's saying.

If you require a preacher to quantify every little thing he says he believes, then 1 hour sermons would turn into 4 hour sermons.

Let him preach, then go back and see if it agrees with scripture... just like this.

SisTrev

04-13-2007, 12:35 PM

The reason Bro Branham says you need to pray this thing threw before marriage is the fact that so many people jsut get married because of "feelings" and dont make sure its the Lords will...then they meet someone else who stirs up the same "feelings" and think they are supposed to be with them...Thus ending in divorces and remarriages. If you have prayed thru about your "mate in life" then God will give you the perfect match.

God forsaw it all before the foundation of the World. He makes no mistakes. If you are meant to have 2 mates (2nd one after the 1st one dies, not while the 1st one is living) then that is up to God.

There is no "feelings" in Heaven. Everyone has PERFECT LOVE for everyone else. There will be no husbands/wives there. We'll all jsut be brothers and sisters!!

*forgive me if i'm preaching. I jsut run into this situation a lot and needed to have my say*