View Full Version : What is infinity?
What is infinity? A far reaching question asked rather vaguely....
What does it mean to be infinitly large?
Why does division by zero yield infinity expect when it is dviding its self?
Is the universe inifitly large, or is there an edge where beyond that there is complete darkness?
Does a black hole have infinite mass?
...
Well, as far as the edge of the universe, they have found "infant" gallaxies- gallaxies just starting. So, there must be an edge to it. Beyond that edge - who knows? I'm sure some theorists have address the issue - I'll look it up when I have time. Certainly interesting though.
AgapZoe
02-06-2006, 12:17 PM
mmmmh!!come to think of it?well, i didn't know we had some deep poeple here!!!we must be going somewhere..atleast we are getting a bearing!!! :)
HotShot53
02-07-2006, 12:55 AM
I've thought of it occasionally... but it's too infinite for my finite brain, so I'm just waiting till I get an infinite brain to figure it out :)
NeedGod
02-07-2006, 01:00 AM
infinity means it is endless.
I've thought of it occasionally... but it's too infinite for my finite brain, so I'm just waiting till I get an infinite brain to figure it out :)
what a cool thought! Einstein - prepare to be mesmerized!
NeedGod
02-07-2006, 02:00 AM
oh, oh my! you people do dazzle me. ah, you do all dazzle me often. oh, now i am questioning myself using the chaos theory. oh, oh my!
eagleendtime
12-24-2006, 10:50 PM
you think infinity is incomprehensible. Try this one on for size.
God has had no new thought!
BroTrevor
12-25-2006, 12:08 AM
Well, as far as the edge of the universe, they have found "infant" gallaxies- gallaxies just starting.
Are they just starting? Or are they just so far away, that perhaps they were created the same time as our galaxy,and we're just now seeing the light from them?
God has had no new thought!
Ok, that one is hard to grasp.
joris
12-25-2006, 05:30 AM
What is infinity? A far reaching question asked rather vaguely....well infinity might mean so big you couldn't possible imagine what it looks like; a more mathematical view is that you can "calculate" things about infinity (if "x" goes to infinity then "y" goes to ? infinity or some real value)
You got to speak about mathematics here I guess, as the alternative is far too vague
What does it mean to be infinitly large?especially in mathematics there are things like "this infinity is really an order of magnitude bigger than that one", so... anyway, bigger than anything you could calculate
Why does division by zero yield infinity expect when it is dviding its self?is that true? well it would make sence if it is true I guess. Zero divided by anything remains zero, so it'd be "nice" if zero divided by zero would be zero too
Any other number divided by some value extremely near zero (say 0.1, 0.01, 0.001, etc) becomes extremely large. (for negative numbers it becomes an extremely "large negative" (that is, an extremely low) number
Is the universe inifitly large, or is there an edge where beyond that there is complete darkness?scientists claim the universe is finite, though if that's only based om "big bang" I wouldn't care too much about their claims; anyway in their view it's absurd to ask what is there outside everything that is
Does a black hole have infinite mass?I don't think so, it'd mean the whole universe would be (infinitely fast) drawn into the black hole. oh wait, it's worse, the different black holes would been drawn infinitely fast to each others, giving some nice big hit in a split of a second.
joris
12-25-2006, 05:39 AM
oh, oh my! you people do dazzle me. ah, you do all dazzle me often. oh, now i am questioning myself using the chaos theory. oh, oh my!uhm I think chaos theory doesn't have much to do with infinity :) it's interesting stuff though
Chaos theory is just that mathematics can't predict anything (not really) anymore if two or more "things" interact and depend on each others
The weather is a nice example, temperature and water vaporizing depending on each others, as clouds change the influence of the sun, changing temperature, which in turns changes vaporizing, etc. In effect it means, no matter how much computing power, no matter what, they will never be able to perfectly predict the weather of next week, let alone of the weather after a month
The basis on it is that small initial difference have large effects on the end result, so even a tiny mistake in assumptions (or appromimations) causes the prediction of next week/month to be completely worthless
It's the strongest finding that mathematics (science) just can't answer everything for real-world questions (though some may argue that quantum mechanics did that, that's only on atomic scale, so in real world you wouldn't notice too much of that)
Infinity's easy. It just goes on and on forever.
Now eternity. That one's a toughy.
marichino_freedom
12-26-2006, 11:25 AM
no beginning, no end.
God always was, always is, always will be. That's the one that my brain can't quite wrap around.
i'm dizzy now :D
TommyLewis
12-26-2006, 08:31 PM
Black Holes themselves do not have infinite mass. Different types of black holes are believed to have different masses, calculated relative to the mass of stars. However, at the center of a black hole there is believed to be a singularity with an infinite curvature of spacetime and infinite gravity. I'm not too certain without doing a little research, but this may be believed to have an infinite mass.
The universe is generally considered to consist of all space in which matter exists and in which events can and do occur. In this view there is nothing outside of the universe. The universe is infinite, although what is considered the knowable universe is finite, and actually calculable based on the speed at which information can be transmitted. Of course, the knowable universe is relative to the current position of the "knower," that is, if you move, your knowable universe adjusts for your position.
Some people (especially science fiction writers lol) reject the infinite universe in favor of a view based on the concepts of a multiverse, in which our universe is actually only one of several (undetermined number) of possible universes existing either within spread throughout spacetime (your knowable universe is the universe, outside of that there exists other universes) or somehow layered within spacetime.
I've even read somethings where it is theorized that a seperate universe is spawned with each individual decisions, creating an infinite number of universes existing layered within spacetime. There was a TV show several years ago called Sliders that explored the idea of a multiverse by having its characters travel between universes by creating a wormhole of sorts. Each universe was slightly different than our "home" universe. This is where chaos theory would come into effect, because the small variations often had nearly cataclysmic effects.
Of course, most of the above is based on and requires the acceptance of Einstein's General Relativity and is mainly based on a mathematical view of inifinity, which essentially postulates infinity as being greater than we can calculate. There is obviously more to infinity than that. However, this post is already far too long, and if I start branching out into framing infinity in philosophical terms (philosophy being one of my true passions) this post could begin to approach "bookish" proportions. Therefore, I'll force myself to stop typing now...
joris
12-27-2006, 05:58 AM
This is where chaos theory would come into effect, because the small variations often had nearly cataclysmic effects.unless there are more theories by the name "chaos theory"... it doesn't have anything to do with the "multiple universes" theory
The "multiple universes" is absurd, it sortof assumes your choices are really "random" - would I be the same person if I decided to sin right now? no I don't think so - so the claim that one universe splits with every possible choice option is not reasonable: For me to sin in that choice, or not, would indicate a (small?) difference in character, but the claim was there is no difference as it was only one split
think about it... ;)
Are they just starting? Or are they just so far away, that perhaps they were created the same time as our galaxy,and we're just now seeing the light from them?
A theory I once heard a while back was that the universe wasn't endless, it was kind of like a sphere. So light from our own galaxy could be travelling around the universe back to us, therefore one of those infant galaxies forming could be the milky way trillions of years ago.
Thats just a theory, seems a bit like garbage to me though.
As for the rest of the thread, infinity is just something I just accept and can't grasp. Especially God not being able to have another thought, that implies a finite God although he is infinite, thats not hard to grasp, its impossible to grasp. Like trying to understand Godhead with your own reasoning. Just can't be done.
EllyMae
12-27-2006, 09:41 PM
:shocked: Yikes, okay.. now my brain hurts after reading this thread.
eagleendtime
12-27-2006, 09:56 PM
To me, God not having a new thought is nothing but the infinite. For that covers all possible thoughts.
Take this and it's a poor example. A game of Chess with it's millions of combinations, if you where God, you would know all the combinations and their outcomes. You could make recommendations, to someone who asked you what to do, to better their position, you would know whethter they would heed your advice your not, and what the outcome will be, actually you would already know what it will be, and whether someone will heed you or not. Now multipy that by the billions of people that have populated this earth, and all the combinations that each person could do.
The earth has a set timeframe before God takes total control again, He knows all the permutations, and better still He knows what exactly will happen, and what would be the best for each individual. You cannot surprise the INFINITE GOD
To me, God not having a new thought is nothing but the infinite. For that covers all possible thoughts.
All possible thoughts, that would mean that God is still thinking new thoughts even now though because infinity never ends.
Can God can be infinite in that regard because then would he not have to be thinking sinful thoughts also especially if he thinks all possible thoughts?
God has infinite power but he would never use it to do anything that isn't God-like (out of character for God), therefore his power is expressed in a finite manner? Same with his thoughts then in that he would never think anything that wasn't God-like?
All theoretical questions, and they are why I just accept God as God and don't worry about things like that.
joris
12-28-2006, 06:50 AM
Everything changes if you try to combine God and infinity - as you've seen most of these claims looks absurd, and I think that's because of our interpretation of "infinite"
You remember? The whole bible was written by Jewish people. No not Greek people, Hebrew people. There is a big difference in that. I think our talk in this thread is typical a Greek-type of reasoning, but those people calling God infinite were not Greek, they were Hebrew. Their use of words, their way of reasoning, it's different from our Greek way. Not in any way less than our way, just - different.
Now, this is difficult. I wasn't raised in Hebrew thinking either, but... anyway if you want to reason about God and God being infinite, you at least have to get a feeling for what "infinite" means in the eye of the one calling God infinite, right? If we just have our own view, completely different from the writers view, it becomes a completely different image of God. Are there people on the forum with a Jewish background? They might be able to help out.
For instance, if you know everything before it happens, why'd you be touched by it? It just seems weird; but wait a minute, the idea of knowing everything before it happens is Greek "infinity", a Hebrew writer might not have that in mind at all
There's a subtle problem with Branham too, as... I seem to remember he wasn't of Jewish background either, so he faces the same problems of reading the same words but reading them different than what the Hebrew writers meant...
eagleendtime
12-28-2006, 09:49 PM
It will take all eternity to know God. And in eternity there is no time.
Look at all the thoughts man has had down throught the ages, and God knew what each man was thinking before he thought it. Our very thoughts will condemn us.
blessed
12-28-2006, 09:52 PM
Are we going around in circles here ?
redeemed_lizzi
12-29-2006, 12:46 PM
Everything changes if you try to combine God and infinity - as you've seen most of these claims looks absurd, and I think that's because of our interpretation of "infinite"
You remember? The whole bible was written by Jewish people. No not Greek people, Hebrew people. There is a big difference in that. I think our talk in this thread is typical a Greek-type of reasoning, but those people calling God infinite were not Greek, they were Hebrew. Their use of words, their way of reasoning, it's different from our Greek way. Not in any way less than our way, just - different.
Now, this is difficult. I wasn't raised in Hebrew thinking either, but... anyway if you want to reason about God and God being infinite, you at least have to get a feeling for what "infinite" means in the eye of the one calling God infinite, right? If we just have our own view, completely different from the writers view, it becomes a completely different image of God. Are there people on the forum with a Jewish background? They might be able to help out.
For instance, if you know everything before it happens, why'd you be touched by it? It just seems weird; but wait a minute, the idea of knowing everything before it happens is Greek "infinity", a Hebrew writer might not have that in mind at all
There's a subtle problem with Branham too, as... I seem to remember he wasn't of Jewish background either, so he faces the same problems of reading the same words but reading them different than what the Hebrew writers meant...
Wow, I'd have to seriously reconsider who God is, if He allowed only one group of people to really know who He is. I don't think it would matter if the Bible was written in Cantonese or Xhosa. The oldest book in the Bible is Job and I'm pretty sure Job was not not 'Hebrew'. Yet He knew and understood who God was and is. Paul was Hebrew and yet he realised that his 'Hebrewness' was not what entitled Him to all the promises of God. And it was not because of His 'Hebrewness' but rather in spite of it that he was able to say...
1Finally, my brethren, rejoice in the Lord. To write the same things to you, to me indeed is not grievous, but for you it is safe.
2Beware of dogs, beware of evil workers, beware of the concision.
3For we are the circumcision, which worship God in the spirit, and rejoice in Christ Jesus, and have no confidence in the flesh.
4Though I might also have confidence in the flesh. If any other man thinketh that he hath whereof he might trust in the flesh, I more:
5Circumcised the eighth day, of the stock of Israel, of the tribe of Benjamin, an Hebrew of the Hebrews; as touching the law, a Pharisee;
6Concerning zeal, persecuting the church; touching the righteousness which is in the law, blameless.
7But what things were gain to me, those I counted loss for Christ.
8Yea doubtless, and I count all things but loss for the excellency of the knowledge of Christ Jesus my Lord: for whom I have suffered the loss of all things, and do count them but dung, that I may win Christ,
9And be found in him, not having mine own righteousness, which is of the law, but that which is through the faith of Christ, the righteousness which is of God by faith:
10That I may know him, and the power of his resurrection, and the fellowship of his sufferings, being made conformable unto his death;
(Phillipians 3:1-10)
Now, this is difficult. I wasn't raised in Hebrew thinking either, but... anyway if you want to reason about God and God being infinite, you at least have to get a feeling for what "infinite" means in the eye of the one calling God infinite, right? If we just have our own view, completely different from the writers view, it becomes a completely different image of God.
My mind may not be able to comprehend the fact that God is infinite and that He was always was, but my being not Hebrew is neither here nor there. If the Jews really understood their God, they would have recognised Him when He became flesh and dwellt among them.
The thing about the Bible is, I believe that we are supposed to have the same experiences with God that the writers had. I'm not saying we need to have our lives devastated like Job, or go through the trials Joseph went through. But rather that the lessons and expereinces men like Job and Joseph had with God, we should have too.
So not being Hebrew does not mean you cannot comprehend the nature of God.
joris
12-29-2006, 05:41 PM
:mad: you mangled what I was saying, and I'd be surprised if it wasn't obvious to you I wasn't saying that
again, I was saying if someone calls God infinite, and someone else comes with a whole different definition of "infinite", chances are small they have the same picture of God, as the meaning of "infinite" is not the same to both
This is probably not such an issue if talking about His love - (oh in fact it can be if one has a twisted wordly idea on love) - but when coming up with this type of reasoning on infinite and such, it is an issue
blessed
12-29-2006, 06:54 PM
Don't let this thread turn into another argument....
redeemed_lizzi
12-30-2006, 09:35 AM
My apologies for skewing what you were trying to say. I didn't mean to purposely misunderstand you. And although I'm still not sure where you're going with your thought, I in no way intended to start an argument.
If the Jews really understood their God, they would have recognised Him when He became flesh and dwellt among them.
God blinded them because it wasn't time for the Jews to see who he really was. If the Jews had realized who He was we would have never been given a chance to know the Jew's God. We would have only one choice, Hell.
redeemed_lizzi
01-01-2007, 09:17 AM
God blinded them because it wasn't time for the Jews to see who he really was. If the Jews had realized who He was we would have never been given a chance to know the Jew's God. We would have only one choice, Hell.
That is true :)
:mad: you mangled what I was saying, and I'd be surprised if it wasn't obvious to you I wasn't saying that
The irony knife strikes again.
joris
01-01-2007, 05:48 PM
The irony knife strikes again.man, thanks for such loving, encouraging post
or should I say, people, hide!! Nate's about to start throwing!!
man, thanks for such loving, encouraging post
or should I say, people, hide!! Nate's about to start throwing!!
No need for the theatrics, man. You misread and misquote and misinterpret what people say probably more than anyone on the boards. I understand there's a language barrier involved, but for you to get angry about it?
I was just pointing out the irony of the situation. I thought it was funny.
EllyMae
01-02-2007, 12:27 AM
Okay kids, settle down.
:)
marichino_freedom
01-02-2007, 02:16 PM
no one is out to hurt anyone. none of us would do that on purpose.
and Noe, absolutely.....they needed to be blinded (the jews) to make way for the Gentiles: Us. how thankful i am for that! the jew's day will come, though. then their eyes will be opened.
no one is out to hurt anyone. none of us would do that on purpose.
yeah, but i certainly didn't find Nate's post amusing
Skirty
01-02-2007, 08:16 PM
yeah, but i certainly didn't find Nate's post amusing
I don't really think it was meant to be amusing. He was just pointing out how easy it is to misunderstand, and that people shouldnt be accusing or pointing fingers when it happens.
Christian-Samurai
01-02-2007, 09:29 PM
____cccc_______cccc
__c______c___c______c
_c________c_c_______ c
c__________c_________c
_c________c_c_______ c
__c______c___c______c
____cccc_______cccc
I believe this is what you are looking for :D or maybe not. Best I could do with my limited options :) always good to add a little humor to things once and a while.
eagleendtime
01-02-2007, 09:45 PM
Like that christian samurai.
Reminds me of my college days. While at the dorm I was rooming at, we got jerseys one year, my name was Sideburns, and number infinity (sideways 8).
TommyLewis
01-03-2007, 01:41 AM
unless there are more theories by the name "chaos theory"... it doesn't have anything to do with the "multiple universes" theory
I've been gone for a week or so...and this thread has deteriorated to the point that there is little point in trying to address all of the illogical statements being made...however, since this deals with my previous post, I would like to clarify that chaos theory plays into the multiverse theory in that chaos claims that small changes or actions can have far-reaching effects. The multiverse theory claims that each decision results in a different universe being generated with an indetermined number of variations based on the initial decision.
The "multiple universes" is absurd, it sortof assumes your choices are really "random"
The multiverse theory in NO WAY assumes that decisions are random.
Disclaimer: I don't actually believe the multiverse theory (this version or any other version for that matter). I merely brought it up because it was consistent with the discussion...
joris
01-03-2007, 07:15 AM
I've been gone for a week or so...and this thread has deteriorated to the point that there is little point in trying to address all of the illogical statements being made...however, since this deals with my previous post, I would like to clarify that chaos theory plays into the multiverse theory in that chaos claims that small changes or actions can have far-reaching effects. The multiverse theory claims that each decision results in a different universe being generated with an indetermined number of variations based on the initial decision.but chaos theory isn't even speaking about choosing...
Benoni
01-03-2007, 08:18 AM
God blinded them because it wasn't time for the Jews to see who he really was. If the Jews had realized who He was we would have never been given a chance to know the Jew's God. We would have only one choice, Hell.
Again, this is about the Knowledge of God, I beleive it would be all togetehr good if all gentiles were to go to hell. Afterall, it would not be an issue of Choice!
Also, i thought, when they failed to believe Him, thats when He turned to the gentiles?? i would not know what He would have done, had they recieved Him, ..... maybe , he would have continued relating to them as formerly???
He being infinite knows all things but, the jews rejected Him and he came to us, and theu will realise when the gentile bride is already in Heaven
Does that raise a question?? me it does, what about Moris Cerrullo? he is Jew and has believed Jesus in this generation, is he misplaced?? benny HInn?? etc
azurity
01-03-2007, 08:26 AM
I haven't really read all this, but I was looking for something else and came across this quote, so I thought I'd share it:
WHAT.SHALL.I.DO.WITH.JESUS.CALLED.CHRIST_ JEFF.IN V-6 N-6 SUNDAY_ 63-1124M
68 New York, last week, I was listening at a message quoted, or said by Einstein, the great scientist, the--the what is called the brain of the--of the time. And I was... heard that. Then I went to hear Norman Vincent Peale, on his psychology about how people should do, or walk, and project themselves into psychology.
Then, on Einstein, he was speaking of a galaxy that was out between the system there, out from stars. And if a person could travel at the speed, I believe he said, of light,... Now, I think, what is that,... eighty-six thousand? [Brother Neville says, "Hundred and eighty-six."--Ed.] Hundred, hundred and eighty-six thousand miles per second, that light travels. And now break that down in five minutes, how many millions and billions of miles you'd be. And a--a hundred and twenty million years of light-time it would take you to get to that galaxy. And then a hundred and twenty, or a hundred and fifty million years; a hundred and fifty millions over, and a hundred and fifty million back.
69 And they hit something that stumped them. And they, after going out there and coming back, you would actually take you three million years to make the trip, three hundred million years. Three hundred million years to make the trip, and, when you come back to the earth, actually you've only been gone fifty years. You break into Eternity. There is no end to It.
70 And to think, that, the God Who made all of that and set it in order, and spoke of it, come down and was made flesh among us, to redeem us. And would so honor us with His august Presence, that He--He would stand here on this sinful earth in the last days, and prove His Word to be so, because He's obligated to that Word. Amen. The sovereignty and the justice of that great One Who holds those things in His hand!
joris
01-03-2007, 09:05 AM
Does that raise a question?? me it does, what about Moris Cerrullo? he is Jew and has believed Jesus in this generation, is he misplaced??I don't know about Moris Cerrullo; anyway, there are "Messianic Jews", anyway Jews who received Jesus as the Messiah.
Now wait. Peter was a jew too. Paul was one too, all those 3000 people coming to believe on pentecostal day, they were jews.
However, most jews reject Jesus, they did then, they do, still
benny HInn??if I remember correctly Benny Hinn is not a jew - he grew up in Israel, but he is not a jew
Benoni
01-03-2007, 09:45 AM
Am really or was reaaly interested in those jews who seem to have believed( because believeing is of the heart) after the blinding!
I know many here will have answers, am sorry for my laziness, maybe the prophet talked about it but i havent come across it.
joris
01-03-2007, 09:49 AM
Am really or was reaaly interested in those jews who seem to have believed( because believeing is of the heart) after the blinding!well, I don't really know about that - though, I believe, if christians around them prayed, and God answered these prayers to show... He answers the prayers of His children :)
HotShot53
01-03-2007, 02:10 PM
Joris makes a great point... most of the Christians just after Jesus was here were Jews, so it's obvious that Jews can receive Christ too. I believe any one individual Jew can receive Jesus as much as any one individual Gentile... there is no Jew nor Greek (gentile) in Jesus (paraphrasing... sorry, my memory doesn't usually remember more than paraphrases...)
azurity
01-03-2007, 09:10 PM
sorry, my memory doesn't usually remember more than paraphrases...
Which is why we have the ability to look our paraphrases up... *grin*
Maybe these will help...
ROMANS 1:16
For I am not ashamed of the gospel of Christ: for it is the power of God unto salvation to every one that believeth; to the Jew first, and also to the Greek.
ROMANS 10:12
For there is no difference between the Jew and the Greek: for the same Lord over all is rich unto all that call upon him.
GALATIANS 3:28
There is neither Jew nor Greek, there is neither bond nor free, there is neither male nor female: for ye are all one in Christ Jesus.
COLOSSIANS 3:11
Where there is neither Greek nor Jew, circumcision nor uncircumcision, Barbarian, Scythian, bond nor free: but Christ is all, and in all.
HotShot53
01-03-2007, 10:26 PM
Which is why we have the ability to look our paraphrases up... *grin*
Lol, I know... except I was on lunch break at work, and didn't have the time... thanks for looking them up for me ;) The third one you quoted is the one I was thinking of, though they all work.
TommyLewis
01-04-2007, 03:18 AM
but chaos theory isn't even speaking about choosing...
Thats irrelevant...the point is that small changes (individual choices being an example of a small chage) can have large effects...
eagleendtime
01-04-2007, 10:34 PM
small changes can result in mighty effects. All eve did was listen and acted on Satan's words, and that upset the whole world.
joris
01-05-2007, 06:42 AM
small changes can result in mighty effects. All eve did was listen and acted on Satan's words, and that upset the whole world.right - but do you believe there's a universe in which nobody ever sinned?
much worse, do you believe there's a universe in which Jesus would have given in to temptation?? I don't
No, the idea of doubling universes with every possible decision, it's nonsence
azurity
01-05-2007, 06:52 AM
right - but do you believe there's a universe in which nobody ever sinned?
much worse, do you believe there's a universe in which Jesus would have given in to temptation?? I don't
No, the idea of doubling universes with every possible decision, it's nonsence
People believe that?
That's... interesting.
BroTrevor
01-05-2007, 12:33 PM
No, the idea of doubling universes with every possible decision, it's nonsence
Pretty sure everyone here believes that.
They were merely throwing it out in a studious manner for the purposes of academic discussion.
HotShot53
01-05-2007, 02:36 PM
right - but do you believe there's a universe in which nobody ever sinned?
much worse, do you believe there's a universe in which Jesus would have given in to temptation?? I don't
No, the idea of doubling universes with every possible decision, it's nonsence
I think the people that believe in doubling universes, generally aren't Christians... for the above reasons, if nothing else....
eagleendtime
01-05-2007, 11:51 PM
Mutliple universes, only conjecture. There are several heavens, and dimensions. But all the choices we make are confined to this place, and will come back for either good or evil against us on that "day of Judgement".
joris
01-06-2007, 07:26 AM
Mutliple universes, only conjecture. There are several heavens, and dimensions. But all the choices we make are confined to this place, and will come back for either good or evil against us on that "day of Judgement".might be all true, but it just seems to be nothing but theory; what difference does all that about universes or dimensions make??
TommyLewis
01-06-2007, 07:36 AM
The multiverse is nothing but theory...however there are many versions of varied credibility, and there is alot more to it than I have time or energy to explain here...
eagleendtime
01-09-2007, 10:00 PM
DEDICATION.OF.BUILDING.TO.THE.LORD_ CLEVELAND.TN WEDNESDAY_ 59-0708M
E-5 Therefore Him being infinite... Now, the word "infinite" cannot be broken down into any word by any language. The word "infinite" is like "infinities," it's from there on. And God is infinite. And if I would try to make one quotation what infinite means, that would be, that a hundred million years before the world was ever formed, the infinite God knew every flea that would ever be on the earth, and knowed every time that he'd bat his eye, each of them. That doesn't even start half of what it means to be infinite.
Therefore, God being infinite and omniscient, He knows all things, and He knows everything that's going on at all places at all times. But He Himself is a Person, dwelling in one place. Therefore He could--we could call Him omniscient.
eagleendtime
02-12-2007, 09:46 PM
All children, all the church, everything there is and... God, by His foreknowledge... Now, we don't know. You say, "Brother Branham, can you prove that you're there?" No, sir. I cannot prove it. God could use me for a tool of something else, and use you the same way. But I believe, and by faith I am saved, not by knowledge I'm saved: by faith. That's the way you're saved. That's the way we're all saved.
But remember, God is infinite. Do you believe that? Infinite... By being infinite, that makes Him... And then He's omniscient. Do you believe that? "Omniscient" means "He knows all things." He can't be--He can't be omniscient without being infinite. See, there never was nothing but what He knowed. He knowed every gnat would ever be on earth, and how many times it would bat its eyes, and how much tallow it would make--how much all of them make together.
QUESTIONS.AND.ANSWERS.ON.THE.SEALS_ JEFF.IN SUNDAY_ 63-0324M
486-1 {185} He knowed every breath that you'd breathe and how deep it would go in your lungs; that's infinite. Now, if He's infinite, that makes Him omniscient. Is that right? And if He's omniscient, that makes Him omnipresent, because He knows just exactly the minute, hour, time to the split instance of fifty-five thousandth of a second to when it's going to happen. See? Get the idea now? Then He knows all things; and that's the reason He has all power, knows all things, and can do all things.
JMC_785
02-13-2007, 04:49 PM
Ahem, well, mathmatically it looks like an eight that's too lazy to stand upright..... Only kidding of course, :ok: , naturally infinity by definition is the amount of time it seemingly takes to complete a task that one does not wish to undertake. (Reference The Matt Cross Dictionary of Completely Senseless Definitions, Pub. 3-13-07)
BroTrevor
02-14-2007, 11:44 AM
Ahem, well, mathmatically it looks like an eight that's too lazy to stand upright..... Only kidding of course, :ok: , naturally infinity by definition is the amount of time it seemingly takes to complete a task that one does not wish to undertake. (Reference The Matt Cross Dictionary of Completely Senseless Definitions, Pub. 3-13-07)
What is the stand price going to be when it comes out?
Cherith F.
02-24-2007, 04:36 PM
Well, as far as the edge of the universe, they have found "infant" gallaxies- gallaxies just starting. So, there must be an edge to it. Beyond that edge - who knows? I'm sure some theorists have address the issue - I'll look it up when I have time. Certainly interesting though.
As far as there being other WORLDS out there, I have it from an official World known Austrian Astronomer and Scientist that there is nothing out there. My Uncle H. Makacheck is his first cousin. He does work here in Tucson, AZ at Kit Peak Oberservatory. He also brings his own instruments with Him because they are better than the ones at the observatory. Interesting Huh????
JMC_785
02-24-2007, 08:50 PM
I dunno, apparently rocks have at some point been used monetarily, I'd say aboot three fist-sized polished granites.....
Black Holes themselves do not have infinite mass. Different types of black holes are believed to have different masses, calculated relative to the mass of stars. However, at the center of a black hole there is believed to be a singularity with an infinite curvature of spacetime and infinite gravity...
That is correct. A black hole contains a singularity which is a point in space which has infinite curvature. Which of course according to General Relativity if if an object has an infinite curvature it has inifite gravity. On a side note the none-spinning black hole is a solution to a set of equations in General Relativity.
As far as there being other WORLDS out there, I have it from an official World known Austrian Astronomer and Scientist that there is nothing out there. My Uncle H. Makacheck is his first cousin. He does work here in Tucson, AZ at Kit Peak Oberservatory. He also brings his own instruments with Him because they are better than the ones at the observatory. Interesting Huh????
But the current reason why "earth like" planets have not been found is due to the detection methods being used. However, over two hundred extrasolar planets have been found.
joris
03-08-2007, 08:06 PM
But the current reason why "earth like" planets have not been found is due to the detection methods being used. However, over two hundred extrasolar planets have been found.those are planets bigger than jupiter, "just" not big enough to have become suns.
Those things are too far away, regardless of whether there are "earth like" planets, they aren't finding them with todays techniques, and probably never
those are planets bigger than jupiter, "just" not big enough to have become suns.
Those things are too far away, regardless of whether there are "earth like" planets, they aren't finding them with todays techniques, and probably never
Planets never become stars and also, it does not matter how far away the planets are. One day detection techniques may improve to the point that small planets (like the earth) may be detected.
HotShot53
03-09-2007, 12:04 AM
they have been improving the finding techniques, too... i think I read a couple months ago that they found a rocky planet... it was a whole lot bigger than earth, but it wasn't a gas giant
joris
03-09-2007, 07:36 PM
Planets never become stars and also, it does not matter how far away the planets are. One day detection techniques may improve to the point that small planets (like the earth) may be detected.unless I remember incorrectly, according to scientific claims on the subject, an object /cloud/whatever of a given size is/becomes a sun -- if it's too small, it becomes a planet
not that it matters anyway
JMC_785
01-05-2008, 07:30 PM
Infinity. Adj. Descriptor for the amount of time it seems like I've been absent from the forums. :D
EptonicTermplor
01-05-2008, 09:25 PM
It seems to me that infinity cannot be contained in mathmatics due to the fact that it is not a number. It is a concept that our minds seem to be unable to grasp.
AndrewMichael
01-05-2008, 11:49 PM
It seems to me that infinity cannot be contained in mathmatics due to the fact that it is not a number. It is a concept that our minds seem to be unable to grasp.
Sighs... Mr. Arant. Must I show you again that infinity is a number. And that our infinity in this dimension is not boundless...
Let us not start my theorem. It is not worth discussing.
EptonicTermplor
01-06-2008, 12:27 AM
Your theorem, Mr. Coressel, does not prove that infinity can be contained by mathematics, or that it is comprehendable by mankind. Only that there is an infinite amount of space in a finite amount of time. Our universe does not necessarily fill that infinite amount of space. Even if it did, it would still not lend to helping us comprehend infinity.
Abashai
01-06-2008, 04:33 AM
I think I kinda know about that theorum. Friend of mine showed me once and twas kind of interesting.
Kinda reminds me of another theorum. If a tank is aproaching you theoreticly it is allways approaching half the distance to you. So if it is 120 feet away and barreling towards you it is approaching 60 feet, then approaching 30 feet, 15, 7.5, 3.75, etc. In theory it will never touch you because it is always approaching half, although it will get infinitely close.....
:tank:
Anyone wanna try out this theorum?
Kinda goes to show you some of the mathmatical flaws we have. The think is this is actually being taught and used by professors and engineers around the world (alot more complicated of course).
But here's a bit of an interesting thought. Mathmatically speaking infinity can have starting value. For example if a parabola is on 1,1 then it starts at 1 and goes to infinity. Or visaversa it could start at infinity and end at 1.
Is this theoretically correct though? Can infinity truly have a beginning or an ending?
If its not theoretically correct than just about every law in Calculus, and just about every method used in engineering is flawed.
:crazy:
joris
01-06-2008, 10:01 AM
It seems to me that infinity cannot be contained in mathmatics due to the fact that it is not a number. It is a concept that our minds seem to be unable to grasp.Err no, there are mathematical axioma's* about infinity, it's called "limits".
The tank example can be written as 120/x (where x goes to infinity).
This is defined to be 0
*) axioma's in mathematics are basically assumptions, thought of as "intuitive". If you find faults in mathematics, it probably will end up to be problematic axioma's
In math, you never actually reach "infinity"; practically speaking, limits try to tell what to expect with very big numbers - what "very big numbers" actually means depends on the situation.
JMC_785
01-06-2008, 05:10 PM
I'm pretty sure that most of what's referenced in mathematics as 'infinite' is simply the infinite series or 'counting numbers' ie. 1,2,3,4..... etc. in that sense the series IS infinite but the human ability to comprehend it isn't. I know this sounds like a redundant statement but mathematical theories and laws are quantitive, and while the universe is considered quantitive to some, and not by others, it cannot be quantitively comprehended as a whole. (At least, not humanly.) So I would define 'infinite' as an entity that quantitively has has no capacity for measure.
TommyLewis
01-06-2008, 05:52 PM
I know this sounds like a redundant statement but mathematical theories and laws are quantitive, and while the universe is considered quantitive to some, and not by others, it cannot be quantitively comprehended as a whole. (At least, not humanly.) So I would define 'infinite' as an entity that quantitively has has no capacity for measure.
In other words, mathematics is insufficient to explain anything truely worth understanding...
But I guess it works for all of you small picture left brained drones... ;p
JMC_785
01-06-2008, 06:04 PM
LoL something like that... I just didn't want it to sound that simple. :|
TommyLewis
01-06-2008, 06:10 PM
kiss...
Might as well get straight to the point for us here simple folks...
JMC_785
01-06-2008, 06:16 PM
Small-Picture Left Brained Drones..... Was that technical terminology or a misunderstood compliment? :P
joris
01-07-2008, 09:49 AM
In other words, mathematics is insufficient to explain anything truely worth understanding...That's probably correct, yes. Let's drop mathematics here ;)
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